{"id":926,"date":"2019-10-13T22:44:17","date_gmt":"2019-10-13T22:44:17","guid":{"rendered":"https:\/\/fumcschenectady.org\/blog\/2019\/10\/13\/afterlife-based-on-job-14-and-mark-1218-27\/"},"modified":"2020-02-11T21:45:15","modified_gmt":"2020-02-11T21:45:15","slug":"afterlife-based-on-job-14-and-mark-1218-27","status":"publish","type":"post","link":"https:\/\/fumcschenectady.org\/blog\/2019\/10\/13\/afterlife-based-on-job-14-and-mark-1218-27\/","title":{"rendered":"&#8220;Afterlife?&#8221; based on Job 14 and Mark 12:18-27"},"content":{"rendered":"<p>\nI want to start today by asking<br \/>\nfor your trust \u2013 particularly from those who are here particularly<br \/>\nfor the baptism. \u00a0I do know that the first hymn and the scriptures<br \/>\nhave been an odd match for a baptismal Sunday so far, and it is going<br \/>\nto get worse before it gets better, but it IS going to get better, I<br \/>\npromise.<\/p>\n<p>\n<\/p>\n<p>\nThe question of \u201cwhat happens<br \/>\nafter we die\u201d is relevant to us for two separate reasons. \u00a0One<br \/>\nreason is entirely personal: we want to know if we are simply mortal<br \/>\nand if we cease to exist when we die. \u00a0The other may be just as<br \/>\npersonal, in a different way: \u00a0we want to know if the connects we<br \/>\nhave to those who have died before us are still alive or if they only<br \/>\nfeel that way.<\/p>\n<p>\n<\/p>\n<p>\nBoth of these are good reasons<br \/>\nto want to know, but nevertheless, we don&rsquo;t know what happens after<br \/>\ndeath. \u00a0And our believes about it end up being profoundly personal.<br \/>\nIf we are looking at afterlife through the lens of the Christian<br \/>\nTradition, there are three big questions people to disagree over:<\/p>\n<ol>\n<li>\n\tDoes afterlife exist?<\/li>\n<li>\n\tIf there is an afterlife, do<br \/>\n\tboth heaven and hell exist, or just heaven?<\/li>\n<li>\n\tIf both heaven and hell exist,<br \/>\n\thow are people sorted between them?<\/li>\n<\/ol>\n<p>\nWhile many people have deep<br \/>\nconviction about their answers to these questions, and believe their<br \/>\nanswers to be the \u201cnormal\u201d ones, the truth is that Christians<br \/>\nhave disagreed about this for about as long as there have been<br \/>\nChristians.<\/p>\n<p>For<br \/>\ncenturies, Christianity has taught about afterlife and the existence<br \/>\nof heaven and hell, all while arguing about the means of sorting<br \/>\npeople into each. \u00a0Yet, \u00a0there is also a large group of Biblical<br \/>\nScholars who think that we&rsquo;ve gotten those assumptions wrong. \u00a0They<br \/>\nsay that 1<sup>st<\/sup><br \/>\ncentury Jews, Jesus, and the earliest Christians did not believe in<br \/>\nheaven and hell the way we do. \u00a0At best, heaven and hell were<br \/>\ntemporary resting places while waiting for bodily resurrection that<br \/>\nwould come along with the Kindom of God on earth.<a href=\"#sdfootnote1sym\"><sup>1<\/sup><\/a><br \/>\n \u00a0More commonly, people believed that there was nothing until the<br \/>\nmoment of universal bodily resurrection, which they expected to come<br \/>\nwithin the first generation after Jesus. \u00a0For some others the<br \/>\nperspective of Job 14 was accurate: \u00a0humans die but at least God<br \/>\ndoesn&rsquo;t.<\/p>\n<p>\nFor<br \/>\nthe most part, I think afterlife is an aside to Christianity. \u00a0The<br \/>\ngoal is to build the kindom on earth, not in heaven. \u00a0However, the<br \/>\nreality of deaths of those we love and the looming reality of our own<br \/>\ndeaths don&rsquo;t let us go. \u00a0We really want to know, and for many people,<br \/>\nwhat they believe about afterlife profoundly connects to how they<br \/>\nunderstand God. \u00a0\n<\/p>\n<p>\nNow,<br \/>\nthis is the fifth and final sermon in a sermon series<br \/>\ncomparing the salient points of Moralistic Therapeutic Deism, the<br \/>\ntradition of the Christian Right, and what I&rsquo;ve been calling<br \/>\n\u201cJesus-followers\u201d. \u00a0(That final group is us.) \u00a0Moralistic<br \/>\nTherapeutic Deism was discovered through sociological research on the<br \/>\nbelief system on teenagers, and we have reason to believe it is the<br \/>\ndefault belief system of most Americans. \u00a0Unfortunately, as we&rsquo;ve<br \/>\nfound, its a rather problematic belief system, at least in my<br \/>\nopinion. \u00a0It consists of 5 intersecting assumptions:<\/p>\n<ol>\n<li>\n\t&ldquo;A<br \/>\n\tgod exists who created and ordered the world and watches over human<br \/>\n\tlife on earth.&rdquo;<\/li>\n<li>\n\t&ldquo;God<br \/>\n\twants people to be good, nice, and fair to each other, as taught in<br \/>\n\tthe Bible and by most world religions.&rdquo;<\/li>\n<li>\n\t &ldquo;The<br \/>\n\tcentral goal of life is to be happy and to feel good about oneself.&rdquo;<\/li>\n<li>\n\t&ldquo;God<br \/>\n\tdoes not need to be particularly involved in one&rsquo;s life except when<br \/>\n\tGod is needed to resolve a problem.&rdquo;<\/li>\n<li>\n\t &ldquo;Good<br \/>\n\tpeople go to heaven when they die.&rdquo;<\/p>\n<\/li>\n<\/ol>\n<p>\nToday we are looking at the 5<sup>th<\/sup><br \/>\nand final point, \u201cGood people go to heaven when they die.\u201d\n<\/p>\n<p>\nOf course, if you asked most<br \/>\npeople what Christians think, that would be a key part of the answer,<br \/>\n\u201cgood people go to heaven when they die,\u201d but \u2013 of course &#8211; our<br \/>\ntradition is far more complicated than is generally known.<\/p>\n<p>Historically,<br \/>\nI think the concepts of heaven and hell came into clarity in the 3<sup>rd<\/sup><br \/>\nor 4<sup>th<\/sup><br \/>\ncentury, as that&rsquo;s when the fights over who went where really picked<br \/>\nup. \u00a0So let&rsquo;s look at our three questions:<\/p>\n<ol>\n<li>\n\tDoes afterlife exist?<\/li>\n<\/ol>\n<p>Christians<br \/>\nof good faith disagree about this one. \u00a0Some, including some in this<br \/>\ncommunity, say, \u201cno. \u00a0This life is all there is, so let&rsquo;s make the<br \/>\nbest of it instead of pretending there is more.\u201d \u00a0Others, including<br \/>\nsome in this community, say, \u201cI think so. \u00a0I&rsquo;ve had some<br \/>\nexperiences that lead me to that conclusion and\/or it just feels<br \/>\nright.\u201d \u00a0Still others simply aren&rsquo;t sure. \u00a0Because the \u201cword on<br \/>\nthe street\u201d about Christianity so profoundly conflates belief in<br \/>\nGod with belief in afterlife, I feel the need to say this explicit:<br \/>\nall of these are faithful statements that are congruent with knowing<br \/>\na loving God through Jesus.<\/p>\n<p>\n<\/p>\n<p>\nSo, the second question, which<br \/>\npresumes an answer of \u201cyes\u201d to the first one about afterlife<br \/>\nexisting. \u00a0The second question is:\n<\/p>\n<blockquote>\n<p>\n\t2. \u00a0If there is an afterlife,<br \/>\n\tdo both heaven and hell exist, or just heaven?<\/p>\n<\/blockquote>\n<p>\nI&rsquo;ll admit that I nuanced this<br \/>\none to lead to a particular answer. \u00a0While I&rsquo;m not always confident<br \/>\nabout afterlife (and yet sometimes I am, it is a confusing place<br \/>\ninside my head), I never think there is a hell. \u00a0It just doesn&rsquo;t make<br \/>\nthe tiniest bit of sense to me that over the long run anything but<br \/>\nGod&rsquo;s grace could win out. \u00a0I read one time a suggestion that people<br \/>\ncontinue to have free will after death, and so if heaven is unity<br \/>\nwith God, people can take AS LONG AS THEY WANT to get there, but in<br \/>\nthe end, they will because grace wins. \u00a0Put another way, I simply<br \/>\ndon&rsquo;t believe in a God of eternal punishment, it is incomprehensible<br \/>\nto me. \u00a0That said, I think most modern Christians believe in a heaven<br \/>\nand a hell, and most of them think it is heresy not to. \u00a0(oh. \u00a0Well.)<\/p>\n<p>\n<\/p>\n<p>\nI<br \/>\nthink that for most people who believe that \u201cgood people go to<br \/>\nheaven when they die\u201d and the unspoken but obvious corollary \u201cbad<br \/>\npeople go to hell when they die\u201d there is a desire to believe that<br \/>\nthere is fundamental justice in the world and that bad things are<br \/>\npunished and good things are celebrated and even if we don&rsquo;t see<br \/>\nevidence of that on earth, it will get balanced out later. \u00a0I can<br \/>\nunderstand a desire to believe that! \u00a0\n<\/p>\n<p>\n<\/p>\n<p>\nNow, for me the third question<br \/>\nis null and void, but since Christianity has spent the past 1600-1700<br \/>\nyears fighting over it, I guess we should take a moment to hear the<br \/>\narguments. \ud83d\ude09<\/p>\n<p>\n\t3. \u00a0If both heaven and hell<br \/>\n\texist, how are people sorted between them?<\/p>\n<p>\nPossible answers:\n<\/p>\n<ul>\n<li>\n\tIn order to get into heaven you<br \/>\n\thave to BELIEVE the right things ( \u201cJustification by FAITH.\u201d)<br \/>\n\tThis is the primary perspective of the Christian Right, although it<br \/>\n\tintersects some with the next idea.\n\t<\/li>\n<li>\n\t In order to get into heaven<br \/>\n\tyou have do DO the right things. \u00a0For many of those Christians there<br \/>\n\tis a list of good things and a list of bad things to guide behavior.<br \/>\n\t ( \u201cJustification by WORKS\u201d or \u201cWorks Righteousness.\u201d) \u00a0\n\t<\/li>\n<li>\n\tIn order to get into heaven one<br \/>\n\tmust be baptized. \u00a0This is often even subconscious now. \u00a0This is one<br \/>\n\tof the strongest arguments for infant baptism. \u00a0It is also one of<br \/>\n\tthe strongest arguments against it. \u00a0Some in this mindset will claim<br \/>\n\tthat only baptism in their PARTICULAR part of Christianity will<br \/>\n\tmatter. \u00a0However, when Christianity was much younger, this often<br \/>\n\tresulted in people refusing to be baptized until the very last<br \/>\n\tmoment. \u00a0(I think, in fact, this is the historical basis for the<br \/>\n\tCatholic ritual of last rites.) They thought that once baptized all<br \/>\n\ttheir sins were forgiven, and if it was done late enough they<br \/>\n\twouldn&rsquo;t have time to sin. \u00a0I&rsquo;m not kidding. \u00a0This was very common<br \/>\n\tpractice.<\/li>\n<li>In<br \/>\n\torder to get into heaven we need God&rsquo;s grace, and God&rsquo;s grace given<br \/>\n\tto us results in our ability to have faith. \u00a0(\u201cJustification by<br \/>\n\tgrace alone though faith.\u201d) <b>UMC option <\/b><br \/>\n\t Thus it is not what we do or do not do; nor what we believe or do<br \/>\n\tnot believe that results in our welcome into heaven. \u00a0It is simply<br \/>\n\tGod&rsquo;s nature. \u00a0This does raise a rather large question about those<br \/>\n\twho do not believe in God though.<\/li>\n<\/ul>\n<p>\n<\/p>\n<p>As<br \/>\na reminder of how complicated all of this is, \u00a0I do not think that<br \/>\nour Gospel lesson supports or disproves any of the schools of<br \/>\nthought. \u00a0Rather, it urges humility. \u00a0The Sadducees were trying to<br \/>\ntrick up Jesus, and they brought him a tricky question in order to do<br \/>\nit. \u00a0The question supported their belief about what happens when<br \/>\nwe die, but Jesus&rsquo; answer did not let them trip him up. \u00a0He says,<br \/>\n\u201c\u201cIs<br \/>\nnot this the reason you are wrong, that you know neither the<br \/>\nscriptures nor the power of God? For<br \/>\nwhen they rise from the dead, they neither marry nor are given in<br \/>\nmarriage, but are like angels in heaven. And as for the dead being<br \/>\nraised, have you not read in the book of Moses, in the story about<br \/>\nthe bush, how God said to him, \u2018I am the God of Abraham, the God of<br \/>\nIsaac, and the God of Jacob\u2019? He is God not of the dead, but of the<br \/>\nliving; you are quite wrong.\u201d<\/p>\n<p>\n<\/p>\n<p>\nThis<br \/>\npassage keeps me humble. \u00a0I don&rsquo;t know what it means, I don&rsquo;t know<br \/>\nwhat heaven is like,or if it exists, and that&rsquo;s OK. \u00a0Many of us are<br \/>\nnot same worldview as moralistic therapeutic deism who say \u00a0\u201cgood<br \/>\npeople go to heaven when they die\u201d or the Christian-Right who say<br \/>\nthat and have clarity over who counts as \u201cgood.\u201d \u00a0Many of us<br \/>\nsimply don&rsquo;t know what happens after death.\n<\/p>\n<p>\n<\/p>\n<p>\nI<br \/>\nthink that at the core, the questions of if afterlife exists or not<br \/>\nand whether there is cosmic justice are really questions about<br \/>\nexistential anxiety. \u00a0That is, as beings who are conscious and who<br \/>\nknow we are mortal, we struggle with the reality that someday we<br \/>\nwon&rsquo;t be (at least in this form) anymore. \u00a0\n<\/p>\n<p>\n<\/p>\n<p>\nI<br \/>\nthink that our shared, all the way back to Jesus, Christian Tradition<br \/>\noffers Jesus-followers two ways we can respond to existential anxiety<br \/>\nand the claims of the other traditions. \u00a0If we are about continuing<br \/>\nthe work of Jesus \u2013 about building the kindom and inviting others<br \/>\nto be partners with us in building the kindom \u2013 then our work does<br \/>\nnot end with our deaths any more than Jesus&rsquo; did. \u00a0This is not same<br \/>\nas individual afterlife, but is really powerful in a different way.<br \/>\nCertainly the ways that each of us work towards the kindom is unique,<br \/>\nbut the end goal is shared, and after we are gone others will be<br \/>\nfollowing up on our work with theirs \u2026 until the kindom comes.<\/p>\n<p>\n<\/p>\n<p>The<br \/>\nother piece of our response to existential anxiety is simply trusting<br \/>\nin God. \u00a0Whether or not we cease to exist at the end of our lives,<br \/>\nGod and God&rsquo;s memory will still hold our lives, our loves, our<br \/>\nactions, our thoughts, and our feelings. \u00a0And, whatever is on the<br \/>\nother side of the proverbial curtain \u2013 God IS and God is GOOD and<br \/>\nwhat will be is possible to trust in.<\/p>\n<p>\n<\/p>\n<p>\nAnd<br \/>\nthat brings us full circle to say, that while I know it is awful to<br \/>\nacknowledge death while celebrating a new life, I am happy to say<br \/>\nthat the kindom building and the goodness of God will outlast even the life of the baby baptized today life and thanks be to God for that! \u00a0Amen\n<\/p>\n<p><a href=\"#sdfootnote1anc\">1<\/a><\/p>\n<p>\t(<a href=\"http:\/\/www.christianitytoday.com\/ct\/2008\/april\/13.36.html?paging=off\" target=\"_blank\" rel=\"noopener\">http:\/\/www.christianitytoday.com\/ct\/2008\/april\/13.36.html?paging=off<\/a>)<\/p>\n","protected":false},"excerpt":{"rendered":"<p>I want to start today by asking for your trust \u2013 particularly from those who are here particularly for the &hellip; <a href=\"https:\/\/fumcschenectady.org\/blog\/2019\/10\/13\/afterlife-based-on-job-14-and-mark-1218-27\/\" class=\"more-link\">Continue reading <span class=\"screen-reader-text\">&#8220;Afterlife?&#8221; based on Job 14 and Mark 12:18-27<\/span><\/a><\/p>\n","protected":false},"author":3,"featured_media":0,"comment_status":"closed","ping_status":"closed","sticky":false,"template":"","format":"standard","meta":{"footnotes":""},"categories":[11],"tags":[34,38,28,39,33,121,118,117,119,115,56,116,64,120],"class_list":["post-926","post","type-post","status-publish","format-standard","hentry","category-sermons","tag-fumc-schenectady","tag-progressive-christianity","tag-rev-sara-e-baron","tag-thinking-church","tag-umc","tag-build-the-kindom","tag-christianity-is-complicated","tag-jesus-following","tag-kindom-comes","tag-mdt","tag-schenectady","tag-sermon-series-on-mdt","tag-sorry-about-the-umc-world","tag-trust-god"],"_links":{"self":[{"href":"https:\/\/fumcschenectady.org\/blog\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/posts\/926","targetHints":{"allow":["GET"]}}],"collection":[{"href":"https:\/\/fumcschenectady.org\/blog\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/posts"}],"about":[{"href":"https:\/\/fumcschenectady.org\/blog\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/types\/post"}],"author":[{"embeddable":true,"href":"https:\/\/fumcschenectady.org\/blog\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/users\/3"}],"replies":[{"embeddable":true,"href":"https:\/\/fumcschenectady.org\/blog\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/comments?post=926"}],"version-history":[{"count":1,"href":"https:\/\/fumcschenectady.org\/blog\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/posts\/926\/revisions"}],"predecessor-version":[{"id":1127,"href":"https:\/\/fumcschenectady.org\/blog\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/posts\/926\/revisions\/1127"}],"wp:attachment":[{"href":"https:\/\/fumcschenectady.org\/blog\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/media?parent=926"}],"wp:term":[{"taxonomy":"category","embeddable":true,"href":"https:\/\/fumcschenectady.org\/blog\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/categories?post=926"},{"taxonomy":"post_tag","embeddable":true,"href":"https:\/\/fumcschenectady.org\/blog\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/tags?post=926"}],"curies":[{"name":"wp","href":"https:\/\/api.w.org\/{rel}","templated":true}]}}